[quote="lewspurs"][quote="ionman34"][quote="lewspurs"][quote="ionman34"]I can't believe what I'm reading here. I've watched the game against Chelsea 3 times now and Khaboul, I felt, was one of the stand out players of the match. He got done twice by Zhirkov and once by Malouda in 90 minutes, apart from that he kept the right hand side quiet.
You have said it here ion, he got done by malouda and twice by zhirkov, that could have been costly imo, he isnt a right back and i personally worry what man utd will do against him if he retains the right back slot........not saying he hasnt any ability, but he isnt a right back.
Could have been costly? Are you serious? So every time we have a player beaten by one of the opposition in a part of the field where it 'could be costly' then they need to be dropped?
Ok lets sift through this verbal garbage...............never said anyone had to be dropped, i said that i dont rate kaboul at right back.
That's fair enough Lew you didn't say that, but you are inferring it. The problem I have here is that you are making this statement following the Chelsea game where, apart from 3 instances, Khaboul had the right hand side buttoned up tight.
You keep claiming he 'looks dodgy' at right back but those are THE ONLY 3 TIMES IN 180 MINUTES against both Chelsea and the goons where he was beaten. Let's be generous and say that those 3 times encompassed a minute apiece. That then means that he was meticulous in his defending for 177 minutes.
Please explain to me how this is conclusive proof that he is dodgy in the position.
Seriously Lew, have you even thought about what you've typed?
Silly answer ion, but i suppose its a space filler for you ?
I'll take that as a no then. It was a silly QUESTION really because it's apparent that you haven't.
Modric was beaten to a ball by Deco in the last third. Drop him?
Bale lost the ball in our half which set up one of their attacks. Drop him?
Every loss of the ball is potentially costly but I never seem to see the 'fancied players' getting dug out for their errors.
My evaluation was of kaboul mate, so really your reply is dead in its birthday suit ! so is not applicable.
Of course it's applicable. You based your evaluation on what he did wrong and caned him for it yet he did no more wrong than the stars in the team but they don't get the same treatment?
Your problem is that you cannot answer. You know you're wrong so you avoid the question.
I had to laugh when Lought said that Pav missing three gilt edged sitters was OK because his movement and link up play was good. What a shame he didn't extend the same leniency toward Crouch.
Why mention an argument you have with lought ? tell him mate that you laughed and found it funny.
Because the scenario is the same. Lought detests Crouch and goes out of his way to ignore the positives in his game. You have done exactly the same with Khaboul.
Comparisons Lew. Yet another one you've avoided because it blows huge holes in your 'argument'.
Honestly Lew, how many fullbacks can you name who never get beaten by a nippy winger? I can't name one, and both of these players are full fledged internationals.
Point taken ion ! the best full backs get beaten by nippy wingers! but you say you saw the match 3 times, watch again and see that kaboul didnt even try to chase back when he got beaten, he left it to the next defender, and thats what alarmed me, and thats why i am saying its a dodgy decision to play kaboul at right back when we have kyle walker if corluka isnt fit.
I suggest you watch it again Lew and see where Khabouls movement, after being beaten, takes him to.
Yeah i did, chasing after their dust
Righto Lew, now why don't you actually go and watch it for real this time.
................ok so lets get this into perspective ion, kaboul isnt a right back so therefore he is allowed any errors, my point is that he is dodgy at right back from what i observed, and i still say if harry plays him there against united or man city then he will get mullered.
And yet your observations can still only point to him being beaten 3 times in the entire match against Chelsea with zero references to 'errors' in the goon game.
Again I ask, 3 minutes of 'bad' against 177 minutes of good, how does that qualify as dodgy?
Khaboul was excellent against Chelsea and, those few times he did get done, Dawson was there to clean up.
Cant argue with that, daws was excellent.
So you're not arguing that Khaboul was excellent against Chelsea? Or are you going to use 3 isolated incidents as the vehicle have yet another of our players pilloried without cause?
Read it again mr bright ! daws was brilliant, thats what i said, and kaboul isnt being pilloried he is being rated as dodgy at right back by myself, how is that being pilloried?
Are you serious?
Considering the evidence (3 mins against 177) I'd say that being labelled 'dodgy' after his sterling performances qualifies as being exposed to ridicule or abuse, I know I'd feel that way were I labelled as 'dodgy' after putting in 2 shifts like that.
Now you like to use Bale as the bench mark so often, how many times did you see him beaten? I counted 2.
I have to laugh at this ion ! look at what bale does down the left, the work he puts in is amazing, if he lapses a bit when defending then i think that its excusable, the good bale does far out weighs the bad, plus i think harry gives him artistic license with ekotto covering for him when he goes on one of his raids down the left.
So they score a winner from a mistake by Bale and it's OK but if Khaboul does it, despite having an excellent match, he deserves to be slaughtered? Wind your neck in man, that kind of reasoning is absolute tripe!
Oh for god sake man, its you who are triping your own reasoning, who mentioned bale or any other player, you make it up as you go along, lets stick to kaboul yeah...he isnt good at right back in my opinion.........get the message mr bright ?
You're losing it Lew.
You've given him a rating and to do so you need a comparison. As there were 11 players on the pitch I've picked one of them. It just so happens that I picked the best player on the pitch to show you that mistakes are made by even the best on show.
By my count Khaboul made 1 more error than Bale. He made less errors than Modric or the Hudd, far less than Pav or Defoevbut he is the only one labelled 'dodgy'.
Not once have you been able to justify that. You even went so far as to say that it is OK for Bale to make these mistakes because of the good he does. I happen to agree but what I can't understand is how you've completely glossed over the good Khaboul did throughout the 2 matches and focussed on 3 errors to label him 'dodgy'.
Where is the parity Lew? Where is the fairness in your judgement?
Bale was used as a comparison because he is such a good player but he too can get skinned. Khabouls contribution to the game also had a massive amount of good outweighing the bad yet you choose to ignore this.
Why?
Because he looked dodgy at right back to me ! are you getting the message now mr bright ? thats my opinion and i dont need to explain to anyone on here why i make that opinion
Actually you do Lew if you want to be taken seriously.
Come on mate, justify how you can assess a player as 'dodgy' based on 3 minutes of bad and 177 minutes of good.
you make an opinion and i either say nothing, or i agree or i disagree, but i dont try to make a soap opera of it..get the point in all this now ion .?
Yes, that you're floundering.
I've been fair with you Lew, a lot fairer than you've been with me. I've called your opinion into question because I believe it is wrong. I've put up sound reasoning for my argument (3 v 177) and your argument is basically that the 3 outweigh the 177.
Do you honestly see that reasoning as sound?
I'm getting just a bit fed up of seeing our entire team have an excellent game only for someone to come on and pick out an unfancied player for some unjust criticism, no matter how well he played.
Well fed up is what you will have to be ion because i have an opinion and will put it forward when i deem i want to, and i will say it again that kaboul is well dodgy at right back, i dont need anyone to tell me he had a good game because i saw the match apart from the last 20 minutes when espn let me down, Yes the team played great, and its a fantastic result all agreed mate no problems, i am not knocking the team, to beat chelsea and arsenal in the same week is "triffic" but if we are to aspire to greater things then i think playing kaboul as a makeshift right back will be a weakness that the better teams will exploit, thats my worry ion................
And yet there was no weakness to exploit in either the goon or the Chelsea game so your reasoning is flawed.
How did weaknesses in the goon and chelsea game get into this ?
Because you claimed that he looked 'dodgy', i.e. you think he's weak in the position.
Answer your question?
its another ion avenue to take us up, all round the houses and up the trees to monkey land.............
See above. Your glib remarks can't hide the fact that my argument is sound.
You say the team had a great game yet dig out Khaboul. No one else. No criticism of Pav for missing sitters. No criticism of Bale for missed chances and losing the ball. No criticism of Defoe, Modric, Huddlestone et al. Khaboul contributed as much as any of these but he gets all the criticism.
The thread is called "kaboul " mr bright ! the reply to your question is obvious.
Yes, that you have no sound reason for your criticism whatsoever. The more you post the more obvious it becomes.
And you can't justify one single bit of that criticism either.
Wow !
I rest my case.
He's performed admirably against 2 of the most attacking teams in Europe. He's kept them quiet whilst also providing a good attacking outlet.
Your opinion and you are entitled to it without insults from myself.
So why so many Lew. You've gone out of your way to try to make everyone on here believe that I've insulted you when I haven't in any way, shape or form. I haven't sworn at you or called you any kind of name. That's all come from you. I haven't appealed to any other poster complaining about you or the way you have posted AT me, that's all come from you. I've been forceful in my argument because that's the way I am. When I believe in something strongly I do hammer it home, mostly because so few take any notice unless it comes at them that way.
Ordinarily I'd apologise if I'd gone over the top but on this occasion I haven't, you have ................ In a big way.
Based on the fact that he isn't a regular fullback I'd suggest that he has outperformed the majority of the team because they are playing in accostomed roles.
Your spurs player of the year then ion ? good choice mate..who will win this years epsom derby ? well tell lought because he will remember to keep clear of it.
Is that the best you can do?
I have a team full of players that I believe should be praised for what they have achieved to date. I believe that a player should be praised for playing well and Khaboul has played extremely well in his last 2 games. The evidence proves that being labelled 'dodgy' after his last 2 performances is totally unjust and I won't keep quiet on that.
Over the last few posts it has become overwhelmingly apparent that your assessment hasn't got a leg to stand on. What I find amazing is that you're unable to see this.
Ever think of that?
Not really ! i leave thinking to football intellectuals like yourself.
Evidently.
Incidentally, did you happen to see who the ONLY player to pick up Lampards run for their goal was?
That's right, it was Khaboul. A midfielder, running from deep onto a diagonal ball and his run was picked up by the fullback who very nearly did enough to prevent the goal. Dawson didn't pick it, nor did anyone else.
No comment mate ! i have already said espn crackled and spluttered to a halt with 20 minutes to go.
Lay off the guy, he's done an excellent job against 2 of the best sides in Europe and deserves the faith that Redknapp has placed in him.
Got nothing against the bloke ion ! but give me a little credit mate , i bother to take a bit of time watching games afterwards because i record a few now and again, i was right when you laughed at me for saying ekotto was keeping the seat warm for bale months before bale got his chance because ekotto was crocked
So where were you right Lew? So far Ekotto still owns the left back slot whilst Bale is playing as a winger. You're so busy patting yourself on the back that you've failed to see that obvious fact. The left back slot is Ekotto's, Modric had to move to accomodate Bale.........yeah right ! i just wonder who harry would want at left back given the choice of bale or ekotto ?
OMG you can't be serious.
Bale is fit, Ekotto is fit so Harry has them both to choose from.
Who's our current left back Lew?
he has just moved the team about to accommodate both of them.
No mate, he moved Modric to accomodate Bale full stop. That is why Bale is currently our left sided midfielder and Modric isn't any more.
It's not rocket science, I don't see anyone else being moved from their starting position do you?
, and what i am saying here is that kaboul is well and truly a dodgy risk at right back.
As keeping the likes of Clichy, Arshavin, Malouda and Zhirkov quiet has proven.
Arshavin wasnt playing mate......do stay on the ball ?
OK, my bad. I take it the others were playing then? Or did he not keep them quiet for those 177 minutes?
Well dodgy...............Yep, thats what i said mr bright ! glad you have at last got the message.
Whilst it appears to constantly fly way over your head.
I hope you trimmed your toenails before you jammed your foot in your mouth......and i hope you got new glasses because what you saw and i saw sounds like you have a spec problem.
LOL. So you DID trim your toenails?
If harry plays him at rb in an away game against a good side he will be exposed big time.........i hope not, and i hope i am wrong, in fact i am praying corluka will be back before the man utd game and i am not his greatest fan either.
Huh?
In an away game against a good side?
Granted we were at home but if you think the venue will suddenly make his performances worse then you seriously need to have your bumps felt.
Ha ha ha ! ok mate, we are playing man utd away, they are back in with a chance and will be going hell for leather, good luck to kaboul if he gets that slot again, but dont you worry just a little ?
No, because the goons were in it with a chance and he owned the right. Chelsea were in it with better than a chance and he owned the right side.
Based on his last 2 performances I'd say I have every reason to feel confident in his abilities.
given our past performances there ? i know i do ! i badly want a win there but i cant see it happening with younes at right back.............
So now you're saying that we will lose because he is in the team?
Are you basing this on that 3 minutes again? I know that I'm basing my faith on the 177.
I'm going to stick my neck out here and state that we will soon become accostomed to seeing quality performances from Khaboul. He was bought in the first place because he was rated as one of the best young talents coming out of France. He had a mare in his first season for us and it took a spell at Pompey for him to regain his confidence ...................... Under Harry.
Ok mate ! i hope so too, cant disagree at all with that statement !
That's nice.
Ring any bells this? Young player, having a mare, a bit of TLC from Redknapp and a different player emerges.
Yeah did wonders for bale.....dont like to tell you i told you so ! harrys ok.
Bale springs to mind first, followed by The Hudd, Bentley, Dawson ................ Now Khaboul.
Name me one player I've been wrong about up 'til now
Wrong about kaboul at right back mate ! well iffy ! get the message ?
I got it and pulled it apart in the hopes that you then see how flawed your assessment is.
Get away from this belief that I've argues just to try and make you look silly Lew, I haven't. As Baz Vis and Arnie have observed I have put a decent argument together. Not to get the last word but because I'm right, so far I've backed that when you haven't.
Have you noticed that this only occurs when I believe you, and others, are being unjust to our players? Lought and I argued over his assessment of Crouch and how he blinded himself to the qualities within his game. The irony was that I wasn't arguing for Crouch over Pav, quite the contrary, I was arguing that he was being unjustly labelled as 'crap' when he actually offers a great deal to the team when used properly.
I see this in your assessment of Khaboul, I'd hope that you're reasonable enough to accept that I've put up a far better case for him than you have against him. He may well have a mare against Utd but the assessment is based on his last 2 games and in these he has been excellent.
I'll leave it at that mate, where you take this debate from here is up to you.
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