dos santos wins gold for mexico

ionman34 wrote:

LOBO wrote:

Boltjean wrote:This makes me sick to be honest. You are so right Lee, he did have a good World Cup and we should be hanging on to him and giving him more play time. How many games as he started for us, is it nine?. I did read Vis that he could be on his way to Seville as Harry has to raise fund's in order to buy the player's he want's, Lennon could be another one to leave. In all honesty we do not need to buy player's as we have the player's I feel can make us a great side, it's just Harry does not want to give them a chance to prove how good they are. I do not want to open the Harry debate again, but I just do not like him, this club seems to me to be about Harry and I have never felt that way about any of our managers from the past no matter how bad or how good they were.

This is the problem, arry can't do know wrong, he is so far up himself , and then had the nerve to go on talk sport and say that anyone who complains about THFC and arry in particular especially though's who phones into a radio station are Idiots, yet he was on a Radio station complaining about the fans.., he is all about himself and will never change IMO

No Lobo, Harry can do, and does, plenty wrong. The REAL problem here is not that Harry doesn't like certain players, it's that certain fans don't like Harry. As a result they, or you if you like, jump to conclusions about him because it suits your own personal view of his personality.

You have no proof whatsoever, you just want it to be true and that's enough for you to find him guilty of whatever it is you can dream up at the time.

Lought reckons it took a while for Harry to allow Pav to play. Now you lot choose to believe that it is because Harry didn't like him, but now suddenly does, rather than it took Pav that period of time to get his own act together and knuckle down, as Harry stated was the case.

Well guess what, Pav knuckled down and, lo and behold, got plenty of playing time.

Have you considered that maybe Harry 'likes' a player that is prepared to put in the graft and earn the right to play in the first team? Have you considered that maybe GDS hasn't done that just yet?

You compare him to King? Spare me. King is a senior pro who has earned his Spurs and can be forgiven the odd infraction. What is it, 2 over the last 10 years? At a time when he was in bits over whether his career had gone tits up?
In contrast, GDS is a junior pro, hasn't even earned the right to a run of games, considering past 1st team performances and continual training tardiness, let alone his Spurs and has no excuse whatsoever for clubbing like a Hollywood A lister.

It's far too easy for you lot to just label me as one who believes that 'Harry can do no wrong'. It then means that you don't have to back up your argument because you dismiss mine. Well guess what, I do think Harry drops rickets, some real Pearls in fact. I get p*ssed off with him about some of the things he does and says. Choosing not to air them in public doesn't negate my right to pull you up if I think you're wrong though. This isn't about arguing for Harry if you like him, or against him if you don't, it's about applying a little logic to your argument. If you can't then you really don't have one and should just be quiet.

There's an old saying, 'It's better to remain quiet and have people think you're stupid, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.'

LOBO wrote:

ionman34 wrote:

LOBO wrote:

Boltjean wrote:This makes me sick to be honest. You are so right Lee, he did have a good World Cup and we should be hanging on to him and giving him more play time. How many games as he started for us, is it nine?. I did read Vis that he could be on his way to Seville as Harry has to raise fund's in order to buy the player's he want's, Lennon could be another one to leave. In all honesty we do not need to buy player's as we have the player's I feel can make us a great side, it's just Harry does not want to give them a chance to prove how good they are. I do not want to open the Harry debate again, but I just do not like him, this club seems to me to be about Harry and I have never felt that way about any of our managers from the past no matter how bad or how good they were.

This is the problem, arry can't do know wrong, he is so far up himself , and then had the nerve to go on talk sport and say that anyone who complains about THFC and arry in particular especially though's who phones into a radio station are Idiots, yet he was on a Radio station complaining about the fans.., he is all about himself and will never change IMO

No Lobo, Harry can do, and does, plenty wrong. The REAL problem here is not that Harry doesn't like certain players, it's that certain fans don't like Harry. As a result they, or you if you like, jump to conclusions about him because it suits your own personal view of his personality.

You have no proof whatsoever, you just want it to be true and that's enough for you to find him guilty of whatever it is you can dream up at the time.

Lought reckons it took a while for Harry to allow Pav to play. Now you lot choose to believe that it is because Harry didn't like him, but now suddenly does, rather than it took Pav that period of time to get his own act together and knuckle down, as Harry stated was the case.

Well guess what, Pav knuckled down and, lo and behold, got plenty of playing time.

Have you considered that maybe Harry 'likes' a player that is prepared to put in the graft and earn the right to play in the first team? Have you considered that maybe GDS hasn't done that just yet?

You compare him to King? Spare me. King is a senior pro who has earned his Spurs and can be forgiven the odd infraction. What is it, 2 over the last 10 years? At a time when he was in bits over whether his career had gone tits up?
In contrast, GDS is a junior pro, hasn't even earned the right to a run of games, considering past 1st team performances and continual training tardiness, let alone his Spurs and has no excuse whatsoever for clubbing like a Hollywood A lister.

It's far too easy for you lot to just label me as one who believes that 'Harry can do no wrong'. It then means that you don't have to back up your argument because you dismiss mine. Well guess what, I do think Harry drops rickets, some real Pearls in fact. I get p*ssed off with him about some of the things he does and says. Choosing not to air them in public doesn't negate my right to pull you up if I think you're wrong though. This isn't about arguing for Harry if you like him, or against him if you don't, it's about applying a little logic to your argument. If you can't then you really don't have one and should just be quiet.

There's an old saying, 'It's better to remain quiet and have people think you're stupid, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.'

And you sir must be arry PR manager

I like arry, but he's wrong for us imo, hes to out spoken for my liking, he treats the fans as though they have no right to dare question him or his tatic's because the average fan in his eye's are idiots who know nothing about football, those same idiots that go to football week in week out who support there clubs and buy the the new kit each season are just a bunch of idiot's, arry is a likable chap, and when he took over he was good for us, but for all his BS talk and charm there lies beneath this man who is so self propelled who will stop at nothing to get his own way, he comes across as arrogant, he wont admit to making mistakes , he constantly challenges levy in public, this to me is a man who believes he has the right to what he likes.. sorry but im tired of arry and his underhand approach, im just waiting for arry to over step his mark...its coming the day is coming .

LOBO wrote:

ionman34 wrote:

LOBO wrote:

Boltjean wrote:This makes me sick to be honest. You are so right Lee, he did have a good World Cup and we should be hanging on to him and giving him more play time. How many games as he started for us, is it nine?. I did read Vis that he could be on his way to Seville as Harry has to raise fund's in order to buy the player's he want's, Lennon could be another one to leave. In all honesty we do not need to buy player's as we have the player's I feel can make us a great side, it's just Harry does not want to give them a chance to prove how good they are. I do not want to open the Harry debate again, but I just do not like him, this club seems to me to be about Harry and I have never felt that way about any of our managers from the past no matter how bad or how good they were.

This is the problem, arry can't do know wrong, he is so far up himself , and then had the nerve to go on talk sport and say that anyone who complains about THFC and arry in particular especially though's who phones into a radio station are Idiots, yet he was on a Radio station complaining about the fans.., he is all about himself and will never change IMO

No Lobo, Harry can do, and does, plenty wrong. The REAL problem here is not that Harry doesn't like certain players, it's that certain fans don't like Harry. As a result they, or you if you like, jump to conclusions about him because it suits your own personal view of his personality.

You have no proof whatsoever, you just want it to be true and that's enough for you to find him guilty of whatever it is you can dream up at the time.

Lought reckons it took a while for Harry to allow Pav to play. Now you lot choose to believe that it is because Harry didn't like him, but now suddenly does, rather than it took Pav that period of time to get his own act together and knuckle down, as Harry stated was the case.

Well guess what, Pav knuckled down and, lo and behold, got plenty of playing time.

Have you considered that maybe Harry 'likes' a player that is prepared to put in the graft and earn the right to play in the first team? Have you considered that maybe GDS hasn't done that just yet?

You compare him to King? Spare me. King is a senior pro who has earned his Spurs and can be forgiven the odd infraction. What is it, 2 over the last 10 years? At a time when he was in bits over whether his career had gone tits up?
In contrast, GDS is a junior pro, hasn't even earned the right to a run of games, considering past 1st team performances and continual training tardiness, let alone his Spurs and has no excuse whatsoever for clubbing like a Hollywood A lister.

It's far too easy for you lot to just label me as one who believes that 'Harry can do no wrong'. It then means that you don't have to back up your argument because you dismiss mine. Well guess what, I do think Harry drops rickets, some real Pearls in fact. I get p*ssed off with him about some of the things he does and says. Choosing not to air them in public doesn't negate my right to pull you up if I think you're wrong though. This isn't about arguing for Harry if you like him, or against him if you don't, it's about applying a little logic to your argument. If you can't then you really don't have one and should just be quiet.

There's an old saying, 'It's better to remain quiet and have people think you're stupid, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.'

And you sir must be arry PR manager

Far from it mate. It's not like I pounce on every criticism of Harry on here, in fact most of the time I keep schtum when he's being criticised as I think the critique is well founded, I just don't add to it unless I have something further to add. If you notice though, I only post in defence of Harry when the criticism is unfair or unfounded, much as now.



I like arry, but he's wrong for us imo, hes to out spoken for my liking, he treats the fans as though they have no right to dare question him or his tatic's because the average fan in his eye's are idiots who know nothing about football, those same idiots that go to football week in week out who support there clubs and buy the the new kit each season are just a bunch of idiot's,

To be fair, that isn't strictly true. He referred to those that phone into the radio shows as idiots, not all fans in general. I've listened to some of these Einsteins and, I'll tell you, he was generous with some of them! Having said that, this was one of the things that p*ssed me off with him. His PC skills are non existant if he doesn't stop and think first. Quite simply he should have said 'their entitled to their opinion, no matter how good or bad it may be' and left it at that.
In all honesty, I don't think he treats fans as knowing nothing about Football, just as knowing nothing about managing a Premiership side. In that he is 100% right because, let's face it, no matter how much we'd like to believe otherwise, none of us truly have the slightest inkling of what it is about.


arry is a likable chap, and when he took over he was good for us, but for all his BS talk and charm there lies beneath this man who is so self propelled who will stop at nothing to get his own way, he comes across as arrogant,

Nothing wrong with that. For years I've wanted to see arrogance in our team, so long as it is earned. Winners are arrogant but they also need to be clever. I don't think Harry is quite in the same league as SAF and Mourinho when it comes to a mixture of the two.

Then again, who is?


he wont admit to making mistakes

Again, not too much wrong with that either, if done in the right manner. It's at this point that Harry does let himself down.


he constantly challenges levy in public

No he doesn't, that's just what you read into his comments. You could quite easily read nothing more than he's stating the obvious into it as well. He does put pressure on the Chairman to release funds but then don't we, as fans, want him to do this so that we can get in the players that are required for us to advance?
I've never once seen him criticise Danny, only state that he needs 3 'quality' signings.


this to me is a man who believes he has the right to what he likes.. sorry but im tired of arry and his underhand approach, im just waiting for arry to over step his mark...its coming the day is coming .

It may well be, if reports that he and Levy don't get on are to be believed. I, for one, take that with a pinch of salt. Arguments and differences of opinion are par for the course in any and all businesses. Levy is not going to gooner off Redknapp just because they don't see eye to eye, particularly if Harry puts us right back into the CL. Redknapps future hinges on that success. If he fails again then I'll guarantee you he'll be down the road. Levy will move fast to install a manager to install confidence in our stars. Otherwise he risks them moving on. To be honest, I can see this happening before the end of the season if we look like missing out again. I think Levy knows there'll be a mass exodus if we don't make at least 4th. Personally, I think he'll have players looking elsewhere if we don't put in a serious challenge for the title so Harry will need to have his players up for each and every game we play. CC or FA Cup silverware will not be enough, not by a long chalk. We'll need to seriously challenge for the title to stand a chance of keeping our cream, because other teams CAN offer serious title aspirations along with regular CL and huge wages.

Top 3 has got to be the minimum target, Champions has to be the goal. Not just for the fans but for the short term stability of the club.

Loughtonlegend wrote:hes always having sly digs about levy.

Put one up then Lought. If he's always doing it then you'll have plenty to choose from.


i dont care what people do in training its what they do on the pitch that counts,

Which is why he is a Premiership manager and you spend your time complaining about him, and just about anything & everything to do with our club, on an Internet forum.

too many games last season crouch defoe vdv and even bale went missing .

Well the striker one has been put to bed as Pav, Defoe and Crouch, it has been proven, have been played in alternate combinations. VDV and Bale went missing at times but have been shown as consistent match winners. Had Harry dropped them, and we lost the subsequent matches, you be whingeing and second guessing him here too for dropping our star players.

Like I said, you make your argument fit your agenda against Redknapp based on hind sight and isolated incidents then attribute it to your 'Harry has his favourites' tosh without a shred of evidence to back it up. You try to site conjecture as proof and that is laughable.



so ion what about kranker. he trains well. in fact harry brought him twice, tells us fans that he should be given him more playing time but wont because he aint got the bottle to give bale a rest

Well Lought, I can't answer that question as I really don't know the answer. What I won't do though is spit the dummy and make up a spurious reason that 'he's not one of Harry's favourites' because I haven't a clue whether that is true or not.

Nor have you.


Simple formula for you; Statement of fact requires facts.
Without facts there is no evidence, only conjecture.
Conjecture is not truth it is speculation.
Speculation is guesswork.
Guesswork is what you do when you have no idea what the facts are.
Anyone who bases their opinion on a guess rather than facts is an idiot.



I leave it to you to decide whether you want to pursue this any further.

Loughtonlegend wrote:hmm when was the last time bale had a good league game.

there was loads of times he and vdv should of been dropped.

the reason kranker cant get a game is because bale plays every minute of every game if fit. even if hes off form.

how long as harry been a manager. yet hes record is woefull.

hes only highs is 1 fa cup and gettin us 4th

Loughtonlegend wrote:hmm when was the last time bale had a good league game.

there was loads of times he and vdv should of been dropped.

the reason kranker cant get a game is because bale plays every minute of every game if fit. even if hes off form.

how long as harry been a manager. yet hes record is woefull.

hes only highs is 1 fa cup and gettin us 4th

Loughtonlegend wrote:there was games before that where bale took so many kicks and he looked nakerd yet harry still played him the whole 90 minutes.

Yep, I know, and having Kranky on the bench would have been a good option I agree, but I don't agree that it would have been the better option. If Bale is being marked, or kicked, out of the game then you don't swap him for Kracjar, who is slower and less mobile. Bale will always be the better option out there as he is faster, more skillful at speed and far more likely to make something happen from the left than Nico. Harry had the right idea just the wrong personnel. If you have a system nullified then you change the system to put the opposition on the back foot. Harry's idea was to put Crouch on, punt the ball up for either a flick on or just to turn the defence, whereas I believe he should have just adjusted the formation. Put 2 or 3 up front and overload their CB's, suck a defender into the middle thereby opening the flanks more for both Lennon and Bale. By pushing VDV into a more forward role (part of the 3 up front) then Krancjar can come on to occupy the floating role behind the forwards where he can pick up any loose balls when driving at goal.
For me, it isn't Bale that he should have been replacing but Thudd or Modric if they weren't fulfilling the requirements that the change in formation needed. Niko doesn't have Winger pace but he's certainly quick enough for the CM role. Play 3-5-3 and you can have Sandro or Palacios, or both, behind him when he pushes forward or even Luka just behind him, alongside one of the enforcers, to carry on the playmaking. Keep your flanks wide and you have the opposition stretched and almost constantly on the back foot. Niko and VDV can interchange leaving the opposition CB's pulled massively out of position when they're trying to mark or track runs.
In the meantime, the back 3 still have cover from a solid midfield 3 should the opposition break.

As you can probably guess, I do like the 3-5-3 formation as it puts immense pressure on the opposition, but it does require a great deal of discipline and intelligence. Players have to understand their role and stick to it like glue or it can go tits up if they start wandering. That's why I'd only use it as a tactical change. If you have three tactical formations all drilled into the team, that they can flow into seamlessly during the course of a game, then you should really win the vast majority of the games you play. We already play 2 of those formations with the 4-4-1-1 and the 4-4-2, adding 3-5-3 would see us terrorising just about everyone. This is the reason I'd keep Pav because 4-4-2 and 3-5-3 require intelligent movement from your front line. VDV has that and so does Pav. Defoe, for me, doesn't as evidenced by the amount of times he gets caught offside.

Pav would be the best player, in our current frontline, to adapt to the formation changes. We all know he's not suited to the lone front man role but who cares? We bring in a striker who is and we're sorted. Of the strikers we have been linked with, Llorente would be my first choice as he'd fit the role perfectly IMO. If we could get Rossi too then even better because he's one of the more intelligent strikers in the game today. His movement is superb and he'd play off Llorente wonderfully well. What a partnership that would be!
So I'd like to see Krancjar stay. I really like and rate the guy anyway and can see him playing an important role should we get our frontline sorted properly, particularly if Harry looks at adding that extra dimension with a third formation.

vdv was really poor the secound half of the season yet when fit he always started which meant some games we had to drop a striker.

Seeing as our strikers couldn't hit a Cows a*se with a Banjo, I am failing to see where the negative is here.


i think you find rooney went about about 12 games without scoring. imagine how many more points man u would have got if they had put rooney on the bench for a few games.

Already addressed this Lought and you're guessing again. I'd be willing to guess that Utd gained around 2 thirds of the points on offer in those 12 games. If Rooney had been on the bench would they have gained them? If he had been on the bench would his presence, workrate, distribution, assists and general drive been missed and resulted in Utd losing more of those games and, as a result, losing the title?
OK Rooney is a striker, but you can't just turn around and say he didn't score goals therefore he was ineffective because that just doesn't wash. The facts here are that Rooney wasn't dropped and Utd won the title. To suggest that they did it in spite of him is, quite frankly, ridiculous.


but no rooney is untouchable despite never scoring in a world cup game.

Did you not read my post? Rooney is not untouchable because he was dropped by SAF. That is a fact. Once again you are basing an argument on supposition and conjecture. SAF dealt with Rooney well IMO. Dropped him to get his head in order, got the deal ironed out swiftly, then got him back on the pitch fit and fired up. Whichever way you look at it, Rooney is an important player. He never goes missing in a game and never shirks responsibility. I really can't stand the ugly barsteward but there is no denying his importance to Utd and the impact he can have on a game even when not playing well.
This is what I'm saying when I state we really don't have an idea when it comes to EPL management. You are dealing with individuals who all have their own little pecadilo's. Some have towering ego's, some have fragile ego's. Some are mercenaries whilst some have genuine loyalty. Some need to be the centre of things whilst some prefer to be part of the whole. They're all different and all need to be managed differently to get the best out of them. With your more talented players this applies even more so. Those with fragile ego's need to feel that the manager has faith in them, that he'll stick by him even when form deserts. Drop them and they can fall apart even more. Some need that kick in the a*se to get them grafting to gain their place back. Some are so self confident that the manager just KNOWS it's only a matter of time before the form reemerges.

You don't seem to appreciate this Lought and attribute one solution to every problem, drop them.


Management is FAR more complex than that.