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    Defence

    cynicsid
    cynicsid
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    Defence Empty Defence

    Post by cynicsid Fri Oct 08 2010, 21:29

    A few years back we were in a bad way with our defence almost entirely on the sick list and sitting at the bottom of the league. I was one of the loudest defenders of BMJ at the time.

    Has anybody noticed how good we are doing defencivly right now?
    Harry Redknapp?? Naghghgh, he's just a wheeler dealer
    ArnieArdiles
    ArnieArdiles
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    Defence Empty Re: Defence

    Post by ArnieArdiles Sat Oct 09 2010, 01:56

    Well spotted Sid .....Harry has really impressed me with the goals against stats since he's been boss , he's been our best manager for this, what with setting a 70 year record for goals against at WHL last season ...

    I know its only seven games but we're currently third best defense in the premeirship with only the top two, Man City and Chavs conceding fewer ...

    I really do believe under this manager, if we can sort out our goals scored , 4th would be ours no problem and top spot would be our true aim .......
    Berbatov & Keane 50 goals was it ? This is what a front pairing should be giving us and what we now need .. It's a shame but I just cant see any combination of two from our front five ( I include Gio ) giving us anywhere near that and that is why I feel Levy let Harry down this summer by not making that marqee striker signing ...

    By the way Sid ... Years ago I knew a scouser devoted footy fan , Liverpool & Shanks, old skool guy ... Anyway he would tell me about Arthur Rowe and how highly he thought of him and how the manager of the great Hungarian national (The Magical Magyars) team of the 50s followed Rowe's ideas on the game ... I read today that Rowe would do football lectures in Hungary and this is where it all started for them ...

    Your siggy:::::::: Arthur Rowe, the country knows not what it owes you
    Ive not seen it before with regards to Rowe , can you expand on it ? cheers ....
    cynicsid
    cynicsid
    1st Division
    1st Division


    Defence Empty Re: Defence

    Post by cynicsid Sat Oct 09 2010, 03:55

    [quote="ArnieArdiles"]Well spotted Sid .....Harry has really impressed me with the goals against stats since he's been boss , he's been our best manager for this, what with setting a 70 year record for goals against at WHL last season ...

    I know its only seven games but we're currently third best defense in the premeirship with only the top two, Man City and Chavs conceding fewer ...

    I really do believe under this manager, if we can sort out our goals scored , 4th would be ours no problem and top spot would be our true aim .......
    Berbatov & Keane 50 goals was it ? This is what a front pairing should be giving us and what we now need .. It's a shame but I just cant see any combination of two from our front five ( I include Gio ) giving us anywhere near that and that is why I feel Levy let Harry down this summer by not making that marqee striker signing ...

    By the way Sid ... Years ago I knew a scouser devoted footy fan , Liverpool & Shanks, old skool guy ... Anyway he would tell me about Arthur Rowe and how highly he thought of him and how the manager of the great Hungarian national (The Magical Magyars) team of the 50s followed Rowe's ideas on the game ... I read today that Rowe would do football lectures in Hungary and this is where it all started for them ...

    Your siggy:::::::: Arthur Rowe, the country knows not what it owes you
    Ive not seen it before with regards to Rowe , can you expand on it ? cheers ....[/
    quote]

    I'l do better than that flower How about I do this.

    Competition: He or she who can give me the best explanation of my Siggy will win a tour of the 3 Spurs sites (Old Training ground, New developement & stadium)..........By air.
    (can you tell I am looking for excuses to go flying???)
    The winner will have to be 15 stone or under (sorry about that) and be able to get to North Weald. Flight will be about half an hour or so.
    I suppose I will have to say that this is a mates for mates thing not commercial.
    Wadayarekon
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    Defence Empty Re: Defence

    Post by Guest Sat Oct 09 2010, 05:58

    Righto Sid I've done me homework and my answer is - What he done for Hungary (the magic Maygars). . . . . .

    Arthur Sydney Rowe (1 September 1906 - 17 November 1993) was the first manager to lead Tottenham Hotspur football club to the First Division Championship title in 1951. He also 'invented' the successful "one-two" method of play.

    Tottenham were in the second division when Rowe returned to the club as manager in 1949 and his task was to gain promotion. This was achieved by becoming Champions and the following season the First Division Championship was won as well. These back to back championships made Spurs the first post-war team to win back to back titles. This was achieved through the use of 'Push and run' football.

    Rowe's health started to fail and he never fully recovered from a breakdown in 1954. During his recouperation, Jimmy Anderson was made acting manager, to become the full-time manager when Rowe resigned in 1955.

    After leaving Tottenham he took time off to recover and joined Crystal Palace in 1960 bringing them an instant promotion that season. He was then forced to resign through ill health in 1962-63 season, returning briefly as a stand in manager in 1966.

    Rowe was born in Tottenham and began his career at Northfleet before joining Spurs as a schoolboy in 1921 (he also appeared as an amateur for Cheshunt in 1920). He then became a professional with the club in 1929. He was a Tottenham player for 8 seasons, in which time he played 201 games and earning his one and only cap for the England National team. He was forced to retire in 1939 due to a cartilage injury.

    In the aftermath of two humiliating defeats to Hungary (6-3 at Wembley and 7-1 in Budapest) the English press quickly understood that England no longer stood at the pinnacle of the sport. Not just that, we were actually out of touch with the best by light years. Hidegkuti and Puskas sufficiently bemused the rigid W-M England had employed and the Hungarians’ fluidity and superior technical skill flummoxed the England players: ‘We completely underestimated the advances that the Hungarians had made,’ admitted England captain at the time, Billy Wright.

    Yet four years prior to this culturally-awakening defeat, in 1949, an ex-Tottenham player by the name of Arthur Rowe had taken charge of the North London outfit and got them promoted back into the first division. He did it using a simple formula: pass-AND-move.

    Whilst the English malaise was completed in Budapest in 1954 and various publications inexplicably demanded a regression to the 2-3-5 that had seen England flourish – though almost outdated for twenty years – all that was clear by the episode was a stereotypically English failing; an inability to progress naturally and adopt new ideas with any level of enthusiasm. Had the top flight taken more notice of Rowe’s methods in Tottenham’s 1950/51 title success – immediately following promotion – then perhaps we wouldn’t have had such a rude awakening at Wembley in 53’. What’s worse is that Rowe had been in Hungary lecturing in 1940 and brought back their methods to English shores.

    Arthur Rowe was born in North London and made 182 league appearances for Spurs, captaining them to a third place finish in 1934. Injury prematurely ended his playing career in 1939 and he immediately left for Hungary, lecturing football tactics in a government appointed role. Education proved to be two way and the methods of the Hungarians were indelibly marked on his football ideals. Hungary offered identification for Rowe’s own abilities; he played as a deep lying central defender and chose to hold onto possession until an accurate pass became available as opposed to hitting the ball aimlessly long, more in hope than design. Though his own proclivities as a ball playing defender were anomalous, it was only in Hungary that he realised the full extent of their worth: possession was far more valued elsewhere in Europe than in England. In 1949 he was appointed manager of Tottenham and his primary dictum was based, in his own words, on simplicity:

    “Make it simple, make it quick… In fact, mate, it’s just a case of doing the obvious. Football’s a simple game; it’s the players who make it difficult.”
    Rowe’s success in his first two seasons was not due to an overhaul in personnel or formation. Instead he offers yet more weight to the truth about formations: they are neutral. It is the approach and the instructions given to players that make a formation either defensive or offensive. His first act, a signal of intent, was to sign forward thinking fullback Alf Ramsey. Rowe’s explanation is simple and logical and made the team baffling for rigid opposition players:

    “More progress could be made if [Ramsey] pumped 15 yard passes into Sonny Walters [coming deep to collect from the outside right position]. The opposing left back would hesitate to follow Walters back into the Spurs half, which was definitely no-man’s land to the fullback then, thus giving him the vital gift of space. And he could now make an inside pass if Alf followed him up…”
    Rowe was revolutionary in his simplicity. His team was given the reputation of the ‘push and run’ Tottenham side and possession became the key – geometric patterns were exploited by short passes (players assembled in triangles and passed between themselves; second nature in today’s teams). When on top of their game they were unplayable and won the first division in 1951 by four points. Arthur Rowe’s methods bore the blueprint of Spurs’ historic League and cup double only a decade later.

    It is ironic, painful even, to note that Tottenham’s success was still received with relative suspicion. Possession play did not become more widespread and Helenio Herrara’s proclamation in 1960 was indicative of the staunch refusal for progress on home soil:

    “You in England are playing in the style that we continentals used many years ago, with much physical strength, but no method, no technique.”
    Rowe had implemented the simplest ideals and achieved memorable success. And this was all before the embarrassment of Wembley in 1953 against the Hungarians. His own managerial career was cut short at Spurs due to a nervous breakdown but his appointment in 1949 has shaped the way Tottenham have played ever since.


    How's that Sid ? AR was a pioneer of the modern game, infact you could say that Rinus Michels was probably an adherent of Mr Rowe. What goes around comes around. In the old days they called it push & run, in the seventies they called it total football. Today they would say it is the way the game SHOULD be played . . . . . .
    cynicsid
    cynicsid
    1st Division
    1st Division


    Defence Empty Re: Defence

    Post by cynicsid Sat Oct 09 2010, 22:35

    Good, actually very good, but no Cigar I'm afraid. Why does the country owe him so much?????
    cynicsid
    cynicsid
    1st Division
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    Defence Empty Re: Defence

    Post by cynicsid Sat Oct 09 2010, 22:38

    Having said that Vis due to the popularity of this competition your in the driving seat ..LOL
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    Post by Guest Sun Oct 10 2010, 04:27

    crazydriver
    cynicsid
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    Defence Empty Re: Defence

    Post by cynicsid Sun Oct 10 2010, 18:53

    Right thats it, Times up.


    And the winner is...............................................pause..................................................Vis.

    But it was very close. LOL

    The actual reason I started using this siggy Arnie, was after reading that Arthur Rowe was the Manager that showed us and more importantly Sir Alf Ramsey hows it's done. Sir Alf went on to become a manager in his own right and we all know what happend next. It's my view that the innovative pass & move football and the manergerial ethos of arthur had a major influence on Sir Alf's own style of management after all, how could it not, when you can take a 2nd division team add 1 player and then brush aside the 1st division to win it. A feet that could never be done today.

    Hence
    cynicsid
    cynicsid
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    Defence Empty Re: Defence

    Post by cynicsid Sun Oct 10 2010, 19:00

    Vis, I need your weight and contact details. If your up for it you can have a tour of the Spurs grounds by air, we will be flying in a two seater sports plane. An RV9A
    BazSpur
    BazSpur
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    Defence Empty Re: Defence

    Post by BazSpur Sun Oct 10 2010, 21:35

    Nice one Sid. Rep points for you my son.Lets get you off 13.
    ArnieArdiles
    ArnieArdiles
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    Defence Empty Re: Defence

    Post by ArnieArdiles Mon Oct 11 2010, 00:31

    cynicsid wrote:Right thats it, Times up.


    And the winner is...............................................pause..................................................Vis.

    But it was very close. LOL

    The actual reason I started using this siggy Arnie, was after reading that Arthur Rowe was the Manager that showed us and more importantly Sir Alf Ramsey hows it's done. Sir Alf went on to become a manager in his own right and we all know what happend next. It's my view that the innovative pass & move football and the manergerial ethos of arthur had a major influence on Sir Alf's own style of management after all, how could it not, when you can take a 2nd division team add 1 player and then brush aside the 1st division to win it. A feet that could never be done today.

    Hence


    Nooooooooooooooooooo Way Sidney !!!!!

    I just knew it were a Sir Alf Ramsey connection and spent 2 hours Defence 563498 on the internet this morning looking for something , the qoute attributed to a name , lol

    Damn you Google ,,,,,slipped up big time there missing out on Sids qoute .. Defence 513873

    Oh well .... Enjoy the day guys ..... give us a wave as you fly over Chingford lol
    cynicsid
    cynicsid
    1st Division
    1st Division


    Defence Empty Re: Defence

    Post by cynicsid Mon Oct 11 2010, 05:01

    BazSpur wrote:Nice one Sid. Rep points for you my son.Lets get you off 13.

    ta
    cynicsid
    cynicsid
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    Defence Empty Re: Defence

    Post by cynicsid Thu Oct 14 2010, 05:17

    Hope I havent scared you off Vis, Are you up for the flight??
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    Post by Guest Thu Oct 14 2010, 07:34

    I've PM'd ya Sid . . . . . ..

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