Post here for your views on the riots.

cynicsid wrote:IMO the bottom line here is that we have been importing rotton culture for decades and instead of requiring people to fit in we have been bending over backwards to hand out a free life to anyone who wants it.

To many polital figures chasing the vote (or the cash) instead of doing whats right.

Precisely mate. It echoes what I have been saying about previous lessons from the past. The Roman Empire is probably the most prime example with Senators lying, cheating and murdering for political ends, and personal aggrandisement, rather than concentating on decision making for the benefit of the Empire. Influx of foreign elements, both in culture and in person, that undermine the bedrock of the existing culture. The authorities ignoring the rights of all to focus on the rights of the few.

All symptoms of the erosion of the core tenets of a democratic society. History shows the effect these had 2000 years ago and the same is being repeated now. It's not a coincidence that there are so many similarities.

Free democracy comes with a price tag, you must be prepared to face up to anything or anyone who threatens it, that includes everything from ganster style music and PS3 games that include Rape and killing right through to the criminal way that govenment drive down the standard of living by driving down income while driving up the cost of living.

Agreed. With freedom comes responsibility to yourself, your dependants and your fellow man. It is impossible to hear everyone's voice in Parliament so that is why we have elected representatives to be our voice. When over a third of the population really don't care who their representative is, it means that that rep either looks after the few voices who make a point of being heard, or he'she uses their voice to their own benefit and the benefit of whoever pays them the most at the time.
With zero accountability comes corruption and the politics of expediency.Legislature is passed without the majority even being aware of it until too late. I'd bet my left nut that of the 60% who did vote, less than half are actively aware of how their country is run, or any new legislature passed.

Having standards, is laughed at these days but it's the bedrock of a peacfull co existance.

As is respect.


The UK has been subjected to years of dumbing down to create Labour voters the end result of which is there are far too many people who think they can do as they like and the consiquences will only ever be light.

Pure political agenda. Reduction of spending in education means that fewer get a higher standard of education. To combat this the Govt then reduced the curriculum, made it easier, so that exam results would then show an increase in higher grades so that they could claim their policies were improving our education. Their comparison figures were used against previous years.

What they didn't show was that, in relation to International education standards of which we were once a World leader, the standard of education had significantly dropped, as the OECD statistics demonstrate.

Briish students HAVE been dumbed down. British are no longer in demand on a World stage when, once, we were first choice. The World takes noe of the education standard and the UK is very low on the list.
Lower education leads to a more manipulative population, Sheep. They'll understand just enough to believe whatever line you sell them just so long as there's enough to either scare them or settle them.
It's almost like a Medieval feudal society. The Priests were the educated ones there and the population believed every word they said because fear and soothing were used in equal measure.


They should be bringing out laws to allow rioter's to be shot in my view but they are more likley to be fighting over who gets the repair contracts.

BazSpur wrote:Re Dumbing down of education ion. It seems to be a matter of who you want to believe. As usual no one can agree. Even australian education has slipped down the ratings. End of the day, We can all make an argument to suit ourselves.

http://www.bobinoz.com/blog/4077/australian-education-standards-compared-to-the-uk-and-usa/

BazSpur wrote:Then you're waking up with a 'Big
Brother', in whatever shape or form, telling you how to lve, when to
sleep, what to eat, you can't leave the country etc.

Lol, of course I take it, this won't happen in the wonderful land of OZ.

VisionarySound wrote:LOL Colonel(retired) Angry from Tunbidge Wells is alive & well & residing in the Bill Nicholson Forum ! Bloody younsters and there ruination of civilisation. Why are the young disposesed and left on the scrap heap ? Because previous generations, us in other words, have created the situation. Not them. Ask a British kid who has worked hard thro' their education if they feel dumbed down ? I am sure they would tell you to jog on, do one & try and acheive what they have your-self ? As for dumbing down the population to make them vote labour ? What a ridiculous statement. The attack on the working class (traditional labour voters) came thro' thactherism. An attempt to destrory, divide & conquer the moral backbone of this country, the working class. The rich, decadent, selfish tories wanted the spoils & rewards to themselves so they engineered attacks on unions to destroy job security and make workers accept lower wages, worse conditions & a sub-standard standard of living. The mass sale of social housing at cheap prices was a social engineering attempt to create tory voters. Instead it meant that a few cashed in and ruined security of housing for generations to come. The sale of nationalised industries gave the lie that the working man could become a stakeholder but in reality just created obscene wealth for the city wide boys fat cats & took control of prices & job security away from the workers and handed it to shareholders, these days mostly foreign & with no intrest in this country aside from what riches they can take. If you see a breakdown in society in this country I suggest you go back to 1979, earlier if you want to trace the roots of what allowed thacther in the door. If it hadn't of been for the Falklands/Malvinas the bitch would never have seen a second term. So let's blame a nation of jingoistic little Englanders from 30 years ago for todays ills rather then the people who have been born into this green & pleasent Utopia(sic) since then . . . .

ionman34 wrote:

BazSpur wrote:Then you're waking up with a 'Big
Brother', in whatever shape or form, telling you how to lve, when to
sleep, what to eat, you can't leave the country etc.

Lol, of course I take it, this won't happen in the wonderful land of OZ.

There you go again, trying to turn this into a UK versus Oz confrontation. I haven't once made this a "Australia is better than UK so ner' debate. There may well be aspects of British education that are superior to Australian, although your link doesn't even come close to proving that, but that's irrelevant. My point is that UK education standards have declined rapidly on an International scale. Where we were World leaders we are now not even also rans.

You and Vis seem to be taking umbrage with the observations I have made. You seem to think it's me having a swipe at England and all things English. So much so that you have both fallen back on the age old defence mechanism, when someone shows you facts and figures that disprove all of your beliefs .............. Take the P*ss.


I have genuine concerns for the UK. It is my country of birth and I'm a proud Englishman. I'm affiliated to no other country and have no wish to be. It breaks my heart to se my country falling as low as it is but that doesn't mean I'm going to bury my head in the sand about it.

It appeared that you wanted to engage in a civilised debate about the state the country was getting into.

It appears I was wrong.


Can't be arsed any more. When you close your mind off to every Historical comparison, along with Internationally recognised data, then there really is no point.

You will believe what you want to believe and what you're led to believe, which is my point precisely.

BazSpur wrote:

ionman34 wrote:

BazSpur wrote:Then you're waking up with a 'Big
Brother', in whatever shape or form, telling you how to lve, when to
sleep, what to eat, you can't leave the country etc.

Lol, of course I take it, this won't happen in the wonderful land of OZ.

There you go again, trying to turn this into a UK versus Oz confrontation. I haven't once made this a "Australia is better than UK so ner' debate. There may well be aspects of British education that are superior to Australian, although your link doesn't even come close to proving that, but that's irrelevant. My point is that UK education standards have declined rapidly on an International scale. Where we were World leaders we are now not even also rans.

You and Vis seem to be taking umbrage with the observations I have made. You seem to think it's me having a swipe at England and all things English. So much so that you have both fallen back on the age old defence mechanism, when someone shows you facts and figures that disprove all of your beliefs .............. Take the P*ss.


I have genuine concerns for the UK. It is my country of birth and I'm a proud Englishman. I'm affiliated to no other country and have no wish to be. It breaks my heart to se my country falling as low as it is but that doesn't mean I'm going to bury my head in the sand about it.

It appeared that you wanted to engage in a civilised debate about the state the country was getting into.

It appears I was wrong.


Can't be arsed any more. When you close your mind off to every Historical comparison, along with Internationally recognised data, then there really is no point.

You will believe what you want to believe and what you're led to believe, which is my point precisely.

I do think you have it in for England ion. You seem to think it will become a dictatorship here but it couldn't possibly happen in Australia.I don't know what happened but you seem to have a dislike for your country of birth but you fail to admit there are troubles in Aussie too and have been in the past also. I could go into the whole Aborigine thing mate but it seems the debate is now over. It was good and I enjoyed the debate as I always do about politics. No hard feelings mate. It was only a debate.

cynicsid wrote:

If you think we are one step away from a police state then wtf was those police doing watching towns getting wrecked by yobs? WE have to be the the softest state in the world right now, we need to toughen up.

VisionarySound wrote:LOL Colonel(retired) Angry from Tunbidge Wells is alive & well & residing in the Bill Nicholson Forum ! Bloody younsters and there ruination of civilisation. Why are the young disposesed and left on the scrap heap ? Because previous generations, us in other words, have created the situation. Not them. Ask a British kid who has worked hard thro' their education if they feel dumbed down ? I am sure they would tell you to jog on, do one & try and acheive what they have your-self ? As for dumbing down the population to make them vote labour ? What a ridiculous statement. The attack on the working class (traditional labour voters) came thro' thactherism. An attempt to destrory, divide & conquer the moral backbone of this country, the working class. The rich, decadent, selfish tories wanted the spoils & rewards to themselves so they engineered attacks on unions to destroy job security and make workers accept lower wages, worse conditions & a sub-standard standard of living. The mass sale of social housing at cheap prices was a social engineering attempt to create tory voters. Instead it meant that a few cashed in and ruined security of housing for generations to come. The sale of nationalised industries gave the lie that the working man could become a stakeholder but in reality just created obscene wealth for the city wide boys fat cats & took control of prices & job security away from the workers and handed it to shareholders, these days mostly foreign & with no intrest in this country aside from what riches they can take. If you see a breakdown in society in this country I suggest you go back to 1979, earlier if you want to trace the roots of what allowed thacther in the door. If it hadn't of been for the Falklands/Malvinas the bitch would never have seen a second term. So let's blame a nation of jingoistic little Englanders from 30 years ago for todays ills rather then the people who have been born into this green & pleasent Utopia(sic) since then . . . .

ionman34 wrote:

cynicsid wrote:

If you think we are one step away from a police state then wtf was those police doing watching towns getting wrecked by yobs? WE have to be the the softest state in the world right now, we need to toughen up.

[b]I think you've misread me a tad there Mate. I'm not saying you are wrong, indeed I agree that the Police should have the ability to exercise force when and where required, so long as it is within a strict format preventing abuse of that ability. Don't get me wrong, I know that that is a much more difficult prospect than it would at first sound.

What I was getting at was that I don't trust the Gov't to stop at that though. I think they would use any restructuring of the current laws to further impinge on our, or should I say your, freedoms.

Maybe it's just a dose of paranoia on my part.[/b]

cynicsid wrote:

VisionarySound wrote:LOL Colonel(retired) Angry from Tunbidge Wells is alive & well & residing in the Bill Nicholson Forum ! Bloody younsters and there ruination of civilisation. Why are the young disposesed and left on the scrap heap ? Because previous generations, us in other words, have created the situation. Not them. Ask a British kid who has worked hard thro' their education if they feel dumbed down ? I am sure they would tell you to jog on, do one & try and acheive what they have your-self ? As for dumbing down the population to make them vote labour ? What a ridiculous statement. The attack on the working class (traditional labour voters) came thro' thactherism. An attempt to destrory, divide & conquer the moral backbone of this country, the working class. The rich, decadent, selfish tories wanted the spoils & rewards to themselves so they engineered attacks on unions to destroy job security and make workers accept lower wages, worse conditions & a sub-standard standard of living. The mass sale of social housing at cheap prices was a social engineering attempt to create tory voters. Instead it meant that a few cashed in and ruined security of housing for generations to come. The sale of nationalised industries gave the lie that the working man could become a stakeholder but in reality just created obscene wealth for the city wide boys fat cats & took control of prices & job security away from the workers and handed it to shareholders, these days mostly foreign & with no intrest in this country aside from what riches they can take. If you see a breakdown in society in this country I suggest you go back to 1979, earlier if you want to trace the roots of what allowed thacther in the door. If it hadn't of been for the Falklands/Malvinas the bitch would never have seen a second term. So let's blame a nation of jingoistic little Englanders from 30 years ago for todays ills rather then the people who have been born into this green & pleasent Utopia(sic) since then . . . .

I take it you forgot about the 3 day week under labour? I got a great education under that lot. Strikes all over the shop and when I started work the unions were allowed to take cash out of my wages before I got them? what the f*ck was that? I was glad when all that ended and I'm proud to say when 2,000 people walked out the door because the WC had no paper, I went to the supply cupboard and got some, fitted aout the bogs and went back to work. I was blacklegged for that and havent had a good word to say about unions since. The truth is power corrupts and it dont matter how much cash the powerfull bloke has got. Back then it was the shop steward, following that it was the businessman, these days it's the scum on the streets ripping up peoples lives and their lefty do'goody mentors and they were given that power by the loony left.or=orange]

Bloody hell Sid (James lol)thats just like that scene out of 'Carry On At Your Convenience' . . . .

BazSpur wrote:

Haha Classic.